ant1
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uhajdafdfdfa

well my laptop is finally dying and it got me round to thinking, will we still be able to use old hardware in 10, 20 years time. i have computers from 1983, 1984 in here that are still working fine and yet this computer from 2008 is dying. i don't think things are really built to last any more

what will die first, your DS or or your DMG?

so this is also a thread in praise of the good engineering and design of the people who made all the old stuff, that it still works now

and will there be anything appealig about the current generation of consoles in the future anyway? probably not to chiptuners,, the sound hardware is too HD already, but for general retro feel might still appeal to some people

what do you think? will you be using your 2010s hardware in 2020/2030? will you still be using your 1980s hardware in 2020/2030?

kitsch
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matt's mind

the more complicated the device, the more things there are which can go wrong/break.  however some components have expiry dates, so in that way the older things may die first because of part selection rather than the fundamental design.

Jake Allison
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Tulsa, OK

Good question... I say not for any reason than nostaligia or retro appeal for the whipper-snappers

Je Mappelle
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I think a reason people may stop using computers will be because the more powerful modern day machines can often emulate the old ones.

For this reason I probably wont be using old consoles in 2020/2030.

Lazerbeat
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Tokyo, Japan

I must admit, I am consistently surprised at how robust some of the retro gear I have it. My DX11 is a fucking warrior. However my opl3 laptop is on its last legs. One of the reasons I got so into the midibox project is provided you have one (or 3 for opl3) core chips which aren't THAT hard to find. All the other electronics are basically cheap, replaceable off the self components which I guess provides a fair bit of future proofing,

Zef
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A good discussion I've kinda often figured that the Chiptune hardware we're using right now will likely be pretty much the only retro age for music; things just got too HQ too fast, the Xbox simply doesn't have anything unique about its sonic capabilities. I do hope it'll be a while till chiptune dies out, and I'm pretty sure we'll find something else old and obsolete to do by then big_smile

Cathode Rays
Offline
Somerville, MA

It's hard to say what will feel retro in 10-20 years form now.  I'll always identify with the sounds of 80's hardware, but I feel like I'm too disconnected from the current generation to know what they might have nostalgia for when they get older.

To some extent this may have already happened with game systems like the first Playstation, which is close to 20 years old now.  I feel nostalgia for those games and that era, but I don't have any urge to make use of it's technology.

campbell
Offline
Boston, MA

this is very true:

kitsch wrote:

the more complicated the device, the more things there are which can go wrong/break.  however some components have expiry dates, so in that way the older things may die first because of part selection rather than the fundamental design.

whenever i think about this issue, i often think about virtualization and the idea of "movable retro".

as far as virtualization goes, we've already seen rapidly growing development of virtual versions of dedicated hardware/software (nes emulators, nitrotracker for nds, universal audio plugins, arturia software synthesizers). as computing power increases and multitouch, gesture-based, and haptic interfaces continue to gain traction in the electronic music community, i can only see this trend continuing.

"movable retro" is a phrase i just made up because i can't think of anything catchier right now. even gear that i think of as recent is starting to gain a fine retro crust. isn't it hard to believe that the microKORG has been around for a decade? the same goes for "non-musical" gear as well (aughties flip-phones, the aforementioned playstation, etc).

what's really more important, though, is the general mindset that retro gear puts you in. the idea of having no more than five channels to work with can be really inspiring for us, so continued development of flexible, minimalist synthesis technology will be crucial. i'm thinking specifically along the lines of barebones computing projects like the raspberry pi or diy digital synths like the meeblip or shruthi. even analog desktop synths have been surprisingly stripped-down lately: the dsi tetra and moog slim phatty both present a healthy ratio of possibility/constraint for my taste.

campbell
Offline
Boston, MA

christ that was long.

Auxcide
Offline
The Multiverse ::: [CA, Sac]
campbell wrote:

christ that was long.

Christ, I love this thread.

Movable Retro. I like that.

Downstate
Offline
shanghai

i think it will go on for a long long time. i mean when shit starts to really die out....people will find a way to clone them, fix them to a certain extent. i cant see it dying by 2020 no way. maybe 2030, that is a long way...but its also alot of time ofr people to come up with ways of prolonging these old gem's lives aswell. Like old synths, people will always get that shit restored. I think the main reason it could die is cos what je'mappelle said, you can easily run the old shit on the new shit right. I suppose once all us guys die out, like a young kid thats 15 in 2025 is unlikely to give a fuck about gameboys. i guess x box will be retro to them but as said i ll doubt you'll make tunes on that for lack of character........who knows !

4mat
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emulators.  most people use them for development these days as it is.

ashimoke
Offline
Czech republic

Machines with buttons are going to be retro very soon.

akira^8GB
Offline
New York City

Hardware back then was built to last. Nowadays it is made for it to break on purpose. With the rate at which technology advances, wether it breaks or not is irrelevant, you will probably have to change it anyway. This rate is exponential so it will only become shorter.

Specially with computers, I think you can't hold on to one for more than 2 yers without it starting to become useless. It does seem emulation will ultimately be the only way to keep the old machines alive somehow, even though I think the original hardware will keep running as long as you can find components to fix it. I just had my 20 year old Amiga repaired and it has been put to a state of 'like new', so I assume that old dog will be around and kicking, for sure, in 2020.

Last edited by akira^8GB (May 10, 2012 2:26 pm)

akira^8GB
Offline
New York City

double post, sorry

Last edited by akira^8GB (May 10, 2012 2:26 pm)

boomlinde
Offline
Sweden
ashimoke wrote:

Machines with buttons are going to be retro very soon.

I don't belive you for a second! Machines with buttons certainly still have an edge over touch screen/accelerometer devices when it comes to ergonomics. I don't think anyone would happily replace their keyboard with a device they had to look at to use.

As for really old computers, as custom chips and old components die out I think people will come up with transparent replacements, whether they are drop-in chip replacements or replace whole motherboards with some FPGA chip.

I've been toying with the thought that at some point, all our knowledge of some old computers will mostly be based on slightly inaccurate emulators, which means that over a long period of time our ideas of what they were might change a lot. Especially machines that haven't been treated as well as the C64 when it comes to emulation. Many emulators already allow you to set up configurations that would have been impossible on the original machines. WinUAE and recent "classic" amiga software development springs to mind. In WinUAE, you can set the CPU emulation (and chipram and the blitter!) up to be as fast as the host computer can muster. A lot of new software (and whole OS distributions) take advantage of this to the point that they are useless even on the fastest real Amiga accelerators. Mplayer for 68k Amigas? Exists. Amigas that can run it? None, unless you like slideshows. Retro revisionism!