Some questions about genre fusion and band productivity? (Page 2 of 3)

Oh my fukin god lolololololol wtf are u even talking about????????????????????
Thanks for making me laugh

8bit kidd r u avin a gigl ther m8

Don't worry mate, I didn't take offence, lol. When I've played these bands around non-music-geek friends and family, they normally go "huh? wtf is this mess? X and Y don't mix!". I think ANYTHING can be made to work if everybody involved agrees on the general direction of the sound.

And yes, sometimes it's better to just do it yourself, especially if finding musicians is gonna be a lot of effort. I loved being in bands, but generally I don't like depending on people, so I prefer just doing everything myself.

As far as like... technical aspects of mixing chipsounds and live instruments.  The most important thing I have found is that your drummer basically NEEDS an in-ear feed from the chip part, or at least proper monitoring.  Things can fall apart real quick if the drummer gets lost and the robot keeps playing.

As far as flow goes, yeah, things just kind of end up working out the way they will. 

Also, everyone trying to do this should listen to Crying.  They are one of the best at mixing these elements in a cohesive way.

http://wearecrying.bandcamp.com/

I would encourage you to set semistrict practice times. If they cant commit to tuesday at 8, then how are you to play gigs.

if you ask me, totally not true. as far as an objective opinion, i'd say it depends on the drummer. in ears are a condom for your performance, and here's why. as you guys mostly know, ive been at the live chiptunes + instruments thing a longass time now. ive noticed through both experience and observation that an in-ear feed for a drummer is going to take away a substantial part of the feeling/essence in their playing by design because it takes away the sensitivity that your drumkit has by blocking out your feeling of it simply by design of in ear monitors being a thing. i cannot exactly think back to any given performance where this wasnt the case. i feel the same way about the plexiglass wall that gets put up in front of the drummer at shows, though in that case, conversely to doing what you're doing with the chip with an in ear, doing that is comparable to putting a stethoscope on your drumkit. these kinds of things arent conducive to improving with your band as a unit, and it makes you tighter and frankly makes your personal performance a bit more stock in relying on being able to hear. all it can really do is to make an unsure or intermediate drummer appear as if they are 'killer', but being 'killer' is subjective to what any given person thinks as far as any musicians performance, right? its somewhat comparable to the facebook vid thats been going around with the five year old kid playing the system of a down song. he's five, and playing toxicity. thats a cool feat in itself, but when you start breaking down his playing beyond 'whoa a little kid shredding it down', well it becomes easy to pick apart his playing. if in ears makes you better, thats cool for you as a drummer. but in my opinion, and what ive seen, it leaves your bandmates wondering whether or not you're in your own little world at times. its because you are whether you want to be or not, just the same way as wearing earplugs while playing drums affects your playing. its a substantial thing. my playing sort of plateaued until i accepted that if i wanted to get better, i was going to have to accept the hearing loss. because you cant get better when you're sonically trying to sort out whats preprogrammed and whats real. it happens even between just the drums and the chip at equal volumes at times, we're human. it isnt exactly good for your hearing either, and its pretty hypocritical for me to say this considering my hearing now. look at it this way: the chiptune doesnt change, and its always going to be the same. that is the one aspect of live performance that will always be static. the little things in music is what makes live performance worthwhile, and i think a good drummer, or guitarist and bassist or any kind of musical performer is going to naturally put little flourishes into what they do. you sort of have to. in ears put you in the program, the routine. not the live setting, because you're playing to something that was done in the past and doing your best to represent that aspect of it (combined with your playing first and foremost) as something thats a moment in time thats passing. basically it boils down to energy. there is no way to break out of this grind until you decide to take one of your in-ears out. toward the end of me doing it, i usually chose my left ear to do that with, because at least i'd get more of the hihat and snare that way.

as a drummer, especially one performing chipmusic, you need to be able to lock onto those bpm's, timechanges, and nuances to the dynamics in your mind before you even approach a drumkit and do that kind of stuff live. this mentality is given the assumption that you get to the point that you're actively playing shows and/or ready for performance. if you're able to do this, then you're truly ready for performance. i would also say that this is maybe the #1 best advice i can give to a new drummer trying to get better at this in particular, you must be sure of yourself and set yourself apart to be worth a shit and bring something new to chipmusic. drummers like zach hill or billy cobham didnt break the mold by holding anything back, they practiced microlicks and passages with the intention of knowing above all that they've gotta be boisterous at what they do. and unfortunately a big part of that sacrifice and time investment for a drummer is some hearing damage, its inevitable.

if you can visualize in your mind the song and all its details, in ear monitoring becomes less and less important. think of it this way: a drummer keeps time. i know theres definitely songs that i could play that if i did em solo and pasted into their corresponding chip that they would fit without finagling. this is the mentality a drummer should aim to have. its not easy and it takes a fuckload of practice to be able to say 'yeah, i can play virtually any passage i can think of', but if you take the approach in your playing where you dont need to have any preprogrammed material front and center in that way, that through time you will gradually be able to play more and more things that you can think of. it sounds like total bullshit to say it, but its absolutely true. you should be able to switch stuff up on the fly to your liking, but you've gotta be the rock. its militant, yeah. but its what you want out of a drummer. the opposite of this is part of the '-on top of chiptunes' stigma, and thats a whole different topic that im not gonna get into. if you are able to mesh your playing with what youre hearing, its no longer a matter of keeping time or even hearing it. it becomes a matter of feeling it. and its in the in-ear in which the drummer out of thinking its a necessity goes from being the one who naturally holds everything together, the backbone if you will, to holding back not only the energy, but making them sort of a slave to something that takes them out of the show climate and judging from the looks on drummers faces, takes just about all the fun out of it. you essentially wind up starving the band and the listener in a live setting some of the energy that the performance could have.

over the years in doing shows i've used cans, and also used monitors. hands down the better shows have been with monitors and i didnt exactly want to accept that was gonna be the case myself. there has even been times where ive switched between the two in the middle of a song, even cut the chip off entirely. with monitors, you have a much better idea of the on-stage volume and how to control that when chips are involved given a proper soundcheck. with monitors, the chip can become another instrument with a good soundcheck. THIS is what you want. if you're on stage and shit is fucked up, you take the time to sort it out because it has to be addressed. its the nature of the beast. with proper prep that doesnt end up being the case. i would say at this point that having a solid monitor mix is the way that will help you be more conscious of first your playing, and secondly the preprogrammed stuff, which is the way its supposed to be. if your playing isnt good, it doesnt matter what you're playing if you are in time with the chip, because then you're just keeping time. if you have problems with using monitors, then you've gotta be able to improve as a drummer if you are doing things with chipmusic because of the nature of the music itself.

using in ears can help you to get good, no doubt about that. but using in ears in performance is also something thats going to limit your finesse as well as your confidence and abilityto improvise, and that can be improvisation in many different ways, in the song or playing something a little different, or being able to roll with the punches if something goes wrong, or even make a mediocre or 'bad' performance to the performer a little more tolerable while its happening. acoustics in a venue come into play a ton when you get into in ear monitors because you can run into the potential of slopping things up when you think it'll make things tighter because you're in a bigger venue. this can be a big disadvantage in a larger room where you've got dead spots on stage or have more than just a few band members.

wanted to throw my opinion into the mix because i got a pm about this thread. certainly what works for me isnt going to work for everyone. good luck in your musical travels, it is a hell of a lot of fun once you start grinding down on things. i figured it was important to say something based on what ive come to understand for myself that works out and let me continue to get better. i know i havent gone about fully doing things the right way for myself. but if there is one thing i can do in life, its to beat the drum so maybe my thoughts will help someone.