Lazerbeat
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Tokyo, Japan

I am using Renoise and I am slowly getting to grips with the various effects / processors for the various channels but I am a little bit confused about the order to use them in my effects chain. Most of the google results seem very guitar effect specific but the logic seems to be

source audio -> Filters -> compressor/limiter -> pitchshifters/harmonizers -> distortion -> chorusy/phasey/flangy stuff -> delays -> reverb

Does this hold for electronic music also? and a few random questions, I assume EQ would be counted as a filter? what happens when you have something like a punchy kick drum with a bith of EQ/compression/reverb then you want to EQ the whole mix? is it ok to have multiple EQ stages?

Are there any other handy rules to remember for ordering effect?

Thanks people!

XXX

herr_prof
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That seems pretty traditional chain.. i dont like eqing after the compressor, because the compressor is kinda of an EQ in its own way.. you can qucikly loose persctive of the whole thing sticking an eq at the end, but  may wanna.. if even just a simple one to get pespective.

Ive gotten in the habit of bypassing effects in and out until i really understand what the effect is doing. That way you can learn what sounds better instead of just different.

µB
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A gray world of dread

Well, it depends what kind of effect you want. For example Reverb->Chorus can create some interesting effects.

In general, I tend towards
source->modulation->stereo->dynamics->distortion->eq->delay->verb(->mix)(->master chain)

I put filters wherever I want the frequencies modified, which depends on the kind of sound I want to get.

Putting EQ behind compressors/limiters has two advantages, imo: You can easily assign your freq profile, because the comp/lim catches the spikes and you get dynamics back (avoiding brickwalls).

I also have no problem with multiple EQ stages. In fact, my usual approach is to put a rough (3 band) EQ on each chain, then mix. My master chain is usually just a multiband compressor and a 16 band EQ behind that.

akira^8GB
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New York City

A generic effect chain forme is:
EQ (always first) -> Bit crusher -> Delay -> Filter
If I need the compressor,it would go right after the EQ.

I would never put delays and reverb before a filter, it can lead to a shit ton of crappy noises that are irritating.

IS this right?I don't know, then again, I have zero music production theory education tongue

kineticturtle
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Matthew Joseph Payne

Typically the EQ goes before the compressor to avoid making the compressor react to sounds you ultimately aren't going to hear. That applies more to acoustic sources with potential wind noise and transients, but it can apply to chip too - I've seen gameboy wav channel clicks trip a compressor pretty hard before, and I imagine an old machine with a noisy power supply might do something similar.

infradead
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Tacoma WA

whatever sounds good really tongue

color_harmony
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I was taught to approach each track differently, and at the end of the day the most important thing is to make sure each instrument is given it's own space in the mix either through programming, eq, or by moving it in the stereo spread. Whatever gets you to this is acceptable...get creative!!

compressors are usually pretty far down the chain, but for alot of hip-hop producers (on drums and sometimes on samples) it's compressor (around 4 to 1) then eq then compress again.

sometimes it's cool to put a compressor on a send and blend it with the original signal (NY style compression) and you might need to eq before and after to remove what kineticturtle mentioned and to cut out any unintentional reactions with the original signal.

If it's working don't worry about whether or not it's correct.

Trash80
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Los Angeles
akira^8GB wrote:

A generic effect chain forme is:
EQ (always first) -> Bit crusher -> Delay -> Filter

NO! Filters sometimes sound cool pre bit crush. wink Just like using distortion after a filter. It depends on the effect you want to achieve of course.

Lazerbeat wrote:

I assume EQ would be counted as a filter?

Yes. I guess you'd call a EQ a filter when its extreme or changing over time.

Lazerbeat wrote:

what happens when you have something like a punchy kick drum with a bith of EQ/compression/reverb then you want to EQ the whole mix? is it ok to have multiple EQ stages?

Yes. I think if you want things to behave as expected when using a compressor its good to roll off inaudible frequencies (usually the low-lows) so that those frequencies dont screw with the dynamics & settings of your compressor. What frequencies to roll off is generally very hands on, but usually you want to kill anything below 20hz, and soften things around ~50 to ~110hz depending on the amount of bass in the source, and the amount you want to pass though.

Ultra generic setting to visualize: (this might be too extreme or the wrong hz, its really up to you to tune it in correctly)

Generally my chan looks like this:
[source]->[crazy effects or nothing]->[eq if needed]->[compressor if needed]->[track volume & reverb send & delay/chorus send]

[master bus]->[eq]->[effects if needed]->[compressor/limit]->[profit]
* master bus chain disabled when mixing tracks, its only for mastering*

I almost always use a separate fx send for reverb and another for chorus, I dont mix them both together. that way all other tracks in the project can have the same "room/hall/whatever" sound because its shared.  You can do this in Renoise using that "Send" plugin. Also if I mix reverb and chorus/delay things tend to get too muddy and lost.

nitro2k01
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Sweeeeeeden

Instead of having a fixed chain in your mind, you should learn how one effect affects another effect. In particular distortion effects tend to mess things up.
Never put distorsion after reverb/delay effects (unless you're going for the particular effect that that gives.) You will ruin the reverb-ey feel of a reverb if you do that.
Same thing with EO and distorsion. If you put  distortion after an EQ, the EQ will not work in a clean way all the way to the end of the chain. If you want an EQ that works like an mixer channel EQ it needs to be at or near the end. (+/- a reverb/delay effect or two.)

Pretty basic stuff, but things you need to know. I recommend you try different things and inspect the waveform and spectrum. Look what different effects and combinations are doing to the result. Don't just use a spectrum analyzer that just shows momentary peaks like the one in Renoise and most other DAWs. Go for one with spectrogram/sonogram capabilities. Adobe Audition's spectral waveform view is excellent for this. I also found a free VST that does this in real time. ag-works SG-1. (Only Windows, 32-bit VST, it seems.) There's a lot to be learned this way, and it's good idea to chuck that one in right at the end of the master mix to monitor the mix.

µB
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A gray world of dread

Question for those who prefer EQ before compression: My reasoning for doing the other way around is that the compression would change the dynamics of the frequencies and kinda screws with the +/- you assign to them with an EQ. So wouldn't it be better to use the altered (=new) spectrum and work from there? This may be because I tend to prefer Limiters in instrument chains which have a higher ratio/harder knee (and thus result in flatter outputs). That may actually also be a bad habit, feel free to advise me to do otherwise.

Trash80
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Los Angeles

As I stated I use it to roll off low end before compression. nothing really fancy, its just removing elements that would alter the compression settings.

om
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herr_prof wrote:

the compressor is kinda of an EQ in its own way.. .

Hell, in the hands of Daft Punk it's almost an instrument.

It's worth experimenting with all kinds of chains.  For a basslines or bass drum I usually put chorus and filters before dynamics as I want the level to be a constant range. But then sometimes compressing a reverb then eq'ing it can give a nice 80's feel.

Boner
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United States

entire mix -> distortion

mk
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OT: which software do you mainly use, mr 80?

danimal cannon
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buffalo, NY

EQ after compression, fuck... EQ after distortion too.  Also that original signal chain is perfectly fine for just about everything.

an0va
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Honestly in Ableton I've had EQ before AND after a compressor sometimes. The first one is for bass/hi rolloffs and then after compression, the second one is for EQ sculpting/masking/fitting in the mix