MONODEER
Offline
the Netherlands

"How does it need to sound" or "How do you want it to sound?" are the questions I hear a lot from sound technicians at venues during soundcheck. Not a strange one since a gameboy isn't a very common common 'instrument' they have to work with very often.

The thing is... I know how I want to sound but I often get myself in trouble by trying to carefully guide them when they ask. Usually, I try to tell the soundguy that the DMG sounds a bit dull from it's nature and that I want it to sound a bit brighter, that it has a lack of bass that may be boosted a bit and that it can be very sharp in the high frequencies. I also tell them about how my panning works and ask them if they're able to get the sound a bit more in the middle.


For the record: I use 2 DMG's and a simple Dj mixer on stage only. I am not always so lucky I can work with enthusiastic pro's that know their soundsystem perfectly smile  Besides that, I know that bad sound can ruin a performance.


The things I say, trying to guide them, are based on the things I learned from mixing down and EQ'ing my recordings. In that proces, I learned about characteristics (or 'weaknesses') of the sound chip. So I know when I try to give them some tips, that boosting the bass gets me some unwanted low's in the noisechannel, making the sound brighter can be very anoying for snare sounds etc... Next to that, EQing in a venue is a different thing as for mixing down a track.

So, my main question is: What do you guys think is the best way to EQ your DMG's for a live show? I know that it depends on various things like venue, soundsystem etc. and personal preferences but I can imagine that there are some basic settings that can work for everyone using a Gameboy. Basically, trying to get the best out of the sound chip.

And what do you guys think about playing mono when playing in a larger venue? I experienced the DMG's panning can fuck up a track since people can't  hear depending on where they are in a venue. Do you think playing mono brings a more constant sound?


Would really like to hear your opinions, pro-tips, experiences etc.


M!

egr
Offline
Abandoned on Fire

For any live performance, sum everything to mono before sending it to the soundguy. Everyone will have a nicer time.

"Mono or die tryin!"

MONODEER
Offline
the Netherlands
egr wrote:

For any live performance, sum everything to mono before sending it to the soundguy. Everyone will have a nicer time.

"Mono or die tryin!"

Yep! smile I already started doing that recently! It just sounds much better in a room.

From the technical point of view, I have to say that I never had any issues with giving technicians a stereo signal coming from my mixer. I think they already know what to do with that.

MaxDolensky
Offline
Alabama

I use a reference song when working with LSDJ, I used to use the song "Legacy" from Danimal Cannon and Zef's "Parallel Processing" and I do my best to match things like how heavy the bass sounds in my mix, etc. The point being that Dan's pretty great at mixing his stuff on the Gameboy to optimal live performance. I'll play the song then tweak the EQ and walk around the venue and tweak it until I know the track sounds the best it can. Then I'll go back and try it with my songs, and typically only minimal tweaks are needed.

I've been making sure my tracks fit the "Legacy" standard at home for a while now, so I don't even need "Legacy" on my carts. However, it is still my golden standard to measure by for live 2xLSDJ sound. Bear in mind, it's cool to use someone else's song for a soundcheck when no one's really around, and if people ask, tell them who wrote it wink

But yeah, mono mix, and generally have one of your songs play while you walk around the venue and listen to it.

Last edited by MaxDolensky (Feb 9, 2014 3:41 pm)

Fudgers
Offline
Indiana

This isn't a hard rule or anything, but I would strongly recommend incorporating an EQ into your setup, and getting the sound you want beforehand. You're going to always have a difficult time using the engineer's EQ to "improve" your sound in electronic music. He should be EQing to compensate for how the venue's system distorts your original sound. This could also give you a reference if you wanted to compare a direct headphone monitor to the venue monitor sound if you felt there was a problem.

As for describing the chipmusic sound to an engineer, I think the term "dance music" can really go a long way. Even your most traditional engineers will typically know what this means, and that reference means a lot to somebody totally unfamiliar with chip. If your kick isnt present enough, boost around 80-150 Hz, and if the problem is a more general lack of bass make the boost smaller and wider. If the mix sounds "dull", consider a subtle, very wide cut centered around 400 Hz combined with a wide boost in the 3k - 5k range. Ultimately, your material is going to sound different than anybody else's and the trick is to experiment until you have your own specific guidelines.

good luck with your shows!

Last edited by Fudgers (Feb 9, 2014 5:24 pm)

MONODEER
Offline
the Netherlands

I always try with 3 of my own songs that basically cover the whole soundrange in my setlist. From the lowest to the highest frequencies. So, I think I think I come pretty far by listening and discussing with the technician. But I was still thinking there is a way do it better, knowing where the weaknesses of the Gameboy's sound chip are. To EQ better at specific frequencies, with much more detailed setting. This requires a pro technician and some knowlegde about your instrument. But unfortunately, there isn't always a pro behind the mixing table

So, some days ago, I was thinking about making some kind of EQ graph about the caractheristics of the DMG's soundchip to hand over to a soundguy when needed (in extreme situations)

MONODEER
Offline
the Netherlands

@fudgers: I only have a 3 band EQ on my mixer right now so that's pretty much useless for detailling. Next to that, usually the stage monitors don't sound to good. So, it still depends on soundguys since the room is his territory. The thing is just that in the more amateuristic environment I can get a bit dissapointed when the sound isn't good, which is not a good feeling to start a performance.

I am aware that I can be quite anal about my sound. But I experienced that having 15 minutes extra for a soundcheck and putting a little extra effort in it, it can make a huge difference. So, good guidelines and some time can totally improve your sound. Besides that, I usually play in the 'dance music' context, so that's already helping!


But thanks a lot for the tips you're giving me! smile

chunter
Offline
Brunswick, GA USA

You may only have 3 eq bands but if you know them well you can do high and low rolloffs to give the house a nicer signal to work with. It sounds like a nice 10 band EQ should be in your future.

MONODEER
Offline
the Netherlands
chunter wrote:

It sounds like a nice 10 band EQ should be in your future.

Any recommendations?

roboctopus
Offline
Madison, Alabama

I use the same set up as you (MONODEER), it sounds like--two DMGs and a DJ mixer.  I boost the bass and leave the mid range flat and tweak the treble up just a bit (depending on the track).  That usually sounds pretty good to me.

I usually don't make my mix mono, but I do spend a lot of time making sure the levels are consistent within LSDJ and I work within the same volume range track-to-track.

Though maybe I should aim for a more mono mix?  Is that just to compensate for varying volume inconsistencies clubs might have from one side to the other?

Mrwimmer
Offline
Los Angeles, CA
roboctopus wrote:

Though maybe I should aim for a more mono mix?  Is that just to compensate for varying volume inconsistencies clubs might have from one side to the other?


People run mono mixes because most venues have little to no ability to accommodate stereo.  Everything can be hard panned in lsdj per channel from the song screen by holding the B button and pressing left or right.  I usually show up with a stereo set-up, have a talk with the Soundperson about what they can do, and adjust accordingly. 

When I'm eqing a dmg, I scoop the mids a little bit cause I think they sound gross, boost the bass a little bit, and leave the highs a smidgen above flat.  A little bit of compression and/or reverb never hurt a gameboy, either.

MONODEER
Offline
the Netherlands

@ MrWimmer: What do you mean by 'scoop the mids a little bit'? (Sorry, not a native english speaker...)

Mrwimmer
Offline
Los Angeles, CA

I cut a good portion of the mids out.

Edit:  Take everything I say with a grain of salt, as I play guitar and synth over stuff as well as sing, meaning my mixing needs are different than yours.

Last edited by Mrwimmer (Feb 11, 2014 4:47 pm)

MONODEER
Offline
the Netherlands

Ha! That explains since I generally think the DMG's soundchip has a lack of mids and brightness smile

Victory Road
Offline
Gosford, Australia

scooping mids means taking away midrange frequencies, usually over a wide band rather than little notches. really important for a cleaner sound, makes bass and highs sound louder without actually boosting anything! and a mono mix is important so that you sound more or less the same anywhere in the room, but i think with some places/techies (mainly more professional ones) you can get away with some stereo.

also re: EQing a DMG, i always take out that 9.25Khz ringing in recordings but i don't know how important it is live.