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Actually, I believe, if anyone ever got closer to delving into the realm of le punk, it was 8bc.
Unfiltered, raw... and most of the time: shitty music.
I can buy this.
Sorry guys, I was out at the store picking up some fortitude supplements.
With regards to having a black & white perspective of the world, you're pretty far off the mark. Yes, I have a MySpace page -- I'm sure this isn't a surprise to anyone here, but if you want to drop the link 10 more times go for it. You're right, both FOX and MySpace are owned by NewsCorp. Despite this fact, MySpace does not explicitly propound any specific political agenda (that I have seen), while FOX News certainly does (not to mention the increasing amount of religious subject matter).
I don't like FOX News and I don't like MySpace. But there are shades of grey to the world. Keep digging down, and at a certain point you'll see that almost everything is rotten and connected to shit you don't like. So you can cut yourself off and drop out of society completely, or evaluate situations and make decisions as they come up. I've chosen the latter, and if you're reading this so have you.
Keep digging down, and at a certain point you'll see that almost everything is rotten and connected to shit you don't like. So you can cut yourself off and drop out of society completely, or evaluate situations and make decisions as they come up. I've chosen the latter, and if you're reading this so have you.
So much fucking this.
Everything is screwed up, nothing is not.
Yes, yes. Everything sux etc etc. We get it. It can even get philosophical if you care enough to delve in more.
stuff
But what you still failed to see it the following in THIS particular situation:
entertainment =/= politics
Some people use MySpace for Politics, believe it or not. Whether you're aware or not.
Some people use FOX for politics, others don't at all.
Pr1mate's appearance on the show is a example of that. Of using FOX for entertainment purposes.
But you decided, among others to attach this one way negative connotations to it. COMPLETELY disregarding their purpose. Which, what was it?
Oh yeah: entertainment.
Hence the black and white world perspective statement.
BTW, Mr. Sleep: http://www.myspace.com/ureport
That was about a year ago, was in the news and whatnot... was an attempt to fuse FOX News with MySpace. To catch an audience. To make them feel apart of the world that is FOX News. Read up on it I guess. It had every day people report, but only what the head guys thought was appropriate was featured ultimately.
I trust my assumptions. They are my best friends.
I'm sorry to hear that, it seem to be a dominant trait you posses, judging by my observations from the past and present.
I hope you're not apart the criminal justice system, as I for one would be even more worried.
Last edited by Mono (Jul 20, 2010 10:50 pm)
entertainment =/= politics
that's what annoyed me about this thread.
Last edited by tacticalbread (Jul 20, 2010 11:31 pm)
Discussion is a good thing, as long as it doesn't descend into a totally counter-productive flamewar -- which I don't think this thread has. And if some people don't like your music, big fucking deal, don't take it personally. But take a look at what they said and consider whether you can channel it into improving your work.
evaluate situations and make decisions as they come up.
I wish people truly followed this train of thought more often. It'd really reignite some of my personal love for the community...
I consider James and Lydia to be good personal friends of mine. I'm glad they're hitting their goals, and I recognize this performance as one of those goals, even though I personally wouldn't want to participate in something like this because it goes against what I believe in. I'm happy for them.
So yeah, as it relates to this performance, I really don't see anything wrong with critiquing it or its venue. We're all supposed to be critical thinkers, for fuck's sake. Aren't we?
I despise everything about FOX News, and I find some of the attempts in this thread to relate their overt and focused political/racist agenda to a general blanket statement about Myspace and other sites to be flimsy at best.
Having a Myspace band page, for instance, does not disqualify one from critical thought regarding some racist asshole on the television because the two networks happen to be owned by the same person in this example. You can rail against the dissemination of that shit regardless of whatever other concepts or products you consume, and I do not see the hypocrisy in that. Even if everything sucks, that's no reason to be complacent. Doing so is a cheap copout.
Im am actually completely one with the criminal justice system. My opinion of your posts is that your the same dude on multiple accounts. BUT WHY DIGRESS.
@Mono/RG: Well yes, micromusic excluded people like most groups do. They were honest about it, though. I guess I was referring to DIY and the talk about using old shitty stuff and, perhaps, make pretty shitty music. Rephlex blabla. But I think it combined organic organisation (anyone could join & start an HQ, right?) with a sort of community coherence (who wasn't fucked by qfs?).
For me there is no punk-vibe to 8BC, although I was never really involved (in fact, was never much involved in micromusic either tbh hehe) but I think I understand what you mean. In the 70s it might've been pretty new & provocative to get shit music out, but that was 30 years ago and it's time to move on I guess. Anarchism is now even more about building rather than destroying, imo.
Sadly punk rock in the us has become being a dirtier hippie greaser hybrid breaking shit prone burnout versus actually, yknow. doing things.
8bc was certainly a democratic.. if not cohesive ...reflection of the diy spirit of whatever wave of punk rock you chose to believe is the real punk rock.
Having a Myspace band page, for instance, does not disqualify one from critical thought regarding some racist asshole on the television because the two networks happen to be owned by the same person in this example.
Of course it doesn't disqualify oneself from critical thought on a particular subject. I don't believe that's in question. Not from my part. Regardless, it certainly doesn't make your argument any stronger to say the least in regards to all this. Especially when it's pretty clear and fairly known that there have been attempts (and I'd imagine there will be more in the future) to use MySpace for FOX's political agenda (why wouldn't they? They own it.), as I already pointed out for those who believe MySpace is just a "neutral" site. Lets take note: Rupert can not go all out and push FOX on everyone on MySpace. Why? Because it can easily alienate an audience.
Alienated audience =/= less traffic.
To a site which is already suffering, due to le FB. That's not good business practice and in the end of the day: FOX is a business. They will appeal to what gives them an audience and in turn any way to fuel whatever their agenda is, to survive in the years to come.
Ureport however, is a good example of how to identify, infect, and ultimately win over people over at MySpace, in a precise manner on an international site, rather than going all out on a national channel.
@Mono/RG: Well yes, micromusic excluded people like most groups do. They were honest about it, though. I guess I was referring to DIY and the talk about using old shitty stuff and, perhaps, make pretty shitty music. Rephlex blabla. But I think it combined organic organisation (anyone could join & start an HQ, right?) with a sort of community coherence (who wasn't fucked by qfs?).
Being honest about it doesn't change much though, haha. But I guess you're right with that other stuff mentioned. But I think that sort of thinking has been common in electronic music, ever since... well, ever since synths became "old" and cheap to buy second hand. I know I've bought a tremendous amount of old vintage synths, due to them being so cheap. Wasn't trying to be "punk" about it, was simply being reasonable and smart. Logical really.
Although, I wouldn't know how HQs worked, as the farthest i ever delved into Micromusic was after registering and suddenly becoming confused by all the colours and layouts. I personally believe the site's colours/layout is a complete artistic abomination. Annoys/confuses more than anything else. I'd gladly take black/pink/blue or white/green/pink, over bright fucking yellow and brighter than the fucking sky blue and whatnot.
Anarchism is now even more about building rather than destroying, imo.
Yes, *now*. Lets keep in mind: 3+ decades later, after the whole punk shiznay has washed away, to an extent anyway. In fact, especially prior to Punk, anarchy always was about that.
But try telling that to masses and acts that cashed in early on: Rotten sang about Anarchy, and is now living in a fancy big house out here in LA, last I heard anyway. Biggest hypocrisy in Punk rock history. Those who say otherwise are in complete denial. It just goes to show the true colours, it was all just a show for entertainment, and thus should have been only taken as such, while exploiting ideologies already found in society.... and everyone ate it up.
Another good example of how hypocrisy works in society. Successful etc. Productive in ways, even.
Anyway, new generations have emerged, and are embracing different things. However, if you would have shown a teen punk kid the anarchist symbol in the late 70s/80s/90s, he/she more than likely would have associated it with the crappy Sex Pistols or how PHUNK FRAWK IT WAS! JEAAAAAAH, MATE. FUCK THIS SHIT UP, DUDR! YEAAHHH. ROCK N' ROLL, MAHN.
Although, I'm sure there's plenty of people who still do.
Sadly punk rock in the us has become being a dirtier hippie greaser hybrid breaking shit prone burnout versus actually, yknow. doing things.
8bc was certainly a democratic.. if not cohesive ...reflection of the diy spirit of whatever wave of punk rock you chose to believe is the real punk rock.
Read above. Not " 'has' become". "Was" and still is like that. On either part of the world. Blame the Pistols for the majority of all the shit, not all of it of course, but at least who sparked the crap.
Also, why does everyone feel the need to associate other movements/ideology with punk? srsly? DIY existed prior to punk, in one form or another. Anarchy did as well. Lawdy knows anger did as well. People who couldn't play instruments very well, did exist as well. In fact, everything that punk was ever associated with, had been already present in society. Punk simply packaged it for you: to eat up or buy.... or use... if you were at least a little self-motivated.
In geek terms, I always thought Punk as this: Punk is a lot like a pre-compiled LAMP installation package (Linux, Apache, MySQL & PHP, for those of you out of the know). All the tools were already available freely, but someone thought it'd be neat to package it all together and distribute it as such. Since it worked so powerful together, plus it's convenient.
DING DING DING, easy money maker, with something free.
Someone would have done it, in one way or anther. Was bound to happen.
Anyway, I've spent enough time at this at it is.
I'm going out to buy some Fortitude supplements to send out to the East coast. Love letter included.
bye.
Last edited by Mono (Jul 21, 2010 3:51 am)
blah blah blah
For someone that so vocally disapproves of other people making assumptions, you certainly don't seem to have any problem with making some of your own.
Granted, some people use MySpace for politics and some people using FOX News for entertainment, but I think you're the one missing the point here. One of them is inherently / overtly political while the other is not. It doesn't seem that difficult to grasp -- when I turn on FOX News I'm going to be fed a shitstream of conservative political opinions (to put it mildly). While, in the years that I've used MySpace, I cannot think of a single instance in which I encountered a similar situation or anything even remotely resembling it. Instead I'm fed a shitstream of meaningless thx4theadd!s, spam, and other trite shit -- but that's another story.
I have gone out of my way to make it clear that my statements in this thread regarding FOX are personal opinions, completely subjective, and at no point did I condemn or judge Br1ght Pr1mate's decision. In fact, once James posted his reasoning behind the decision I simply expressed gratitude and wished him luck.
If I were sitting at a table eating dinner with a bunch of friends and suddenly spit out my food saying, "this tastes like shit," would I be implying that everyone else enjoys eating shit? Maybe -- but only as an indirect result of voicing my own feelings. Same here with the negative connotations you talk about. Not sure how I could have made it any clearer that I was speaking about how I felt, rather than saying that something was right or wrong (black or white). Strangely enough you seem to be more bent out of shape over this than anyone else here.
Wasn't aware of the ureport thing, which should further emphasize that MySpace is much less politicized than FOX News (I can't even believe I have to argue something that's this obvious). Anyway, you then go on to talk about ways in which this could be used to push FOX's political agenda. But then go back and say that they can't do this because it would alienate their audience and they can't afford to do that. But then they're probably just waiting until the time is right to infect us all. Thanks for the insightful analysis and speculation.
When ureport automatically puts itself in my Top 10 friends and starts sending me rightwing propaganda then I'll reevaluate my level of concern -- but right now my biggest worry about MySpace is tolerating that trainwreck of a site long enough to deny hundreds of spam comments from shitty bands before gouging my eyes out.
Anyway, I've spent enough time at this at it is.
Something we can both agree on. Now, back to tracking until sunrise.
invaderbacca wrote:the fact that this isn't 9 pages of "hey you guys did great" is ridiculous, we all need to learn to just STFU and be happy for our peers
Totally disagree. That kind of vapid echo chamber mentality is dishonest, boring, and leads to stagnation and death.
Just wanted to chime in and say, threads like this make me extremly happy cm.org exists.
[Now, back to tracking until sunrise.
Regardless, it certainly doesn't make your argument any stronger to say the least in regards to all this. Especially when it's pretty clear and fairly known that there have been attempts (and I'd imagine there will be more in the future) to use MySpace for FOX's political agenda (why wouldn't they? They own it.), as I already pointed out for those who believe MySpace is just a "neutral" site.
Right here, you're essentially lumping together years of UNSUCCESSFUL attempts to promote an overt political/racist agenda via MySpace to years of SUCCESS in promoting an overt political/racist agenda via FOX News. It's extremely different, and like Nullsleep, I'm finding myself confused as to how this bears further explanation...
Right here, you're essentially lumping together years of UNSUCCESSFUL attempts to promote an overt political/racist agenda via MySpace to years of SUCCESS in promoting an overt political/racist agenda via FOX News. It's extremely different, and like Nullsleep, I'm finding myself confused as to how this bears further explanation...
Whether it's successful or not, does not change anything. What difference does it make? The intentions are clearly there. hurp?
example: Simply because ruthless murderer failed to kill someone, doesn't change anything in regards to intentions and goals. It just simply means the victim/target got away (for the time being). He'd still get convicted if tried. His intentions were to bring harm.
That's not very nice and friendly now, is it? You wouldn't be quite pleased with that. Since you could have been killed etc
Nullsleep wrote:[Now, back to tracking until sunrise.
Not quite, sorry! >.< I got in about... what 3 to 4 hours of sleep? Fuck. I blame the fucking sudden dramatic change of times zones. Really fucks with your sleeping patterns... that and my secret love for Nullsleep... I... I just want him to notice me and reply back to me... via MySpace.
Is that so much to ask for? xD
Lets face it: I'm all of Nullsleeps fans on there. All my accounts. Right, Peter? Ask Peter, he'd know :]
hahaha
Nah, actually, contrary to what I heard around Blipfestival a bit back e.g. not many liking his set (for various reasons, obviously), I actually thought it was quite an improvement to what I heard of him do ages ago and actually approved of it (not that it matters anyway). I probably enjoyed it a lot more than most people, judging by what I was hearing from people on various IRC channels, to say the least.
For someone that so vocally disapproves of other people making assumptions, you certainly don't seem to have any problem with making some of your own.
Read this:
When ureport automatically puts itself in my Top 10 friends and starts sending me rightwing propaganda then I'll reevaluate my level of concern
"then I'll reevaluate my level of concern"
There's my point in regards to all that. It's more a logical way of thinking, than assumption on my part. There is logical reasoning and then there's pure assumption based on little to nothing, for simple kicks.
If you're gonna place your hand on that hot oven, you're obviously gonna get burned. But heck, be my guest and try it out: completely disregarding any logic behind it all.
I mean, you're proving my point.
If they were to completely go all out, they would alienate an audience, such as you and in turn you would "revaluate" being on myspace, as you put it.
You just proved it. You proved my point. My "supposed" assumptions. Passively agreeing, without even realizing it. What else is there to explain? Srsly?
I don't believe they'd ever go all out and INFECT US ALL! OMGZ. WHAT ARE WE GONNA DO!?! GAIZ. That's just silly. That's just again: bad business practice. I'm also partly basing all this on business/political analyzations from various sources I've read in the past, btw. Not just my own. Would it hurt to read up on it, eh?
.....Naaaah, lets just assume I'm making it all up with my fake accounts, right?
As much as I don't agree with a lot of what FOX does, I've watched FOX news myself in the past briefly, and it's not a constant endless stream of conservative opinion. The fact that they had Br1ght Pr1mate perform, and covered "chip music", saids otherwise. Hurp durp.
Again, you're getting into black and white territory.
There's good and bad in everything, believe it or not. ;p
Ultra liberals can be just as bad as ultra conservatives and vice versa.
While you yourself say you never encountered anything political from myspace, I have. I've seen announcements in regards to various politics there before. Even when I wasn't looking for it. In fact, that's how Ureport came to my attention. I'm not sure how politically you are involved in politics in general, apart from the general omgz fauxnews evil, but I surely am. Thus I'm aware of what's going on to various extents, of course. I can't know everything, obviously. I'm only a general human, with my own general flaws. hurp.
at no point did I condemn or judge Br1ght Pr1mate's decision.
Bullshit, dude. B U L L S H I T. You jumped right away at it:
Yet the community apparently has no problem with making an appearance on one of the most despicable television channels around. We certainly do seem to have a fucked up set of priorities.
... are you srs, man?... are you sure you're not running FauxNews yourself? ;p
wait.... Rupert? AHHHH I KNEW IT! AHA! Playing that joke on me again, eh? How did you pull that one over me again, Rupert?
;p
And yes I'm completely aware it's your personal opinion, but the way it was worded/stated, it is done from a "community perspective:
It doesn't say/state "I" or "me", does it?
It states: WE. WE AS A COMMUNITY
You practically and clearly told Bright Primate that his priorities were "fucked up" in an indirect way, beating around the bush, from a COMMUNITY perspective, rather than a personal perspective. You didn't even have the nerve to directly address them at first. Even though we all knew it was clearly directed towards him. Pretty fucking obvious.
... and only AFTER they explained their reasoning to YOU, specifically (even though there really was no need for it to begin with at all), you eventually did wish them luck and that it was good to hear their reasons on a PERSONAL level, but you forget you had attacked on a COMMUNITY level. Never hinting/suggesting at detracting your previous ORIGINAL statement directed towards them specifically. Because: oh no, you'll look bad if you detract your edgy political comment. So the damage was still done. The portrait of being fucked up in regards to their priorities had already been attached. Well done, you.
Why didn't you ask their reasoning at first, rather than jump to attacks and conclusions with negativity? Why attack them head on without getting the full story? Shoot first, ask questions later? eh?
Heck due to you bringing it all up, Anders even featured it at Chipflip. Somehow I think it would have been ignored otherwise, for whatever reason. Hmm, since the article basically addressed all this, needless/pointless bulldada.
Even 8bw pointed this out:
Bg1ht Pr1mate is now the community? Lets not derail, this is a great opportunity for them, cheers guys!
I'm not seeing things, am I? ;p
Anyway, you then go on to talk about ways in which this could be used to push FOX's political agenda. But then go back and say that they can't do this because it would alienate their audience and they can't afford to do that.
I never said it "can't" be used at all, I said it can't be used to such extreme manners. Completely different to what you're trying to make it out to be. As it's an international site with a much more broader audience than a national show. You have to be more careful. You have to be more focused. More precise.
Lastly, to add more:
I don't see how someone can dare speak at community level (especially based on their personal views) when they are simply ONE person, that makes up a part of that community.
Getting close to jumping the high horse territory, if you ask me, personally.... but whatever, right?
edit: Dude, you guys are too fucking easy at arguments/heated discussion. I had more of a fight from CC's management than you guys.
I think the majory flaw here is that everyone is nicey-nicey and buddies. I think DaPants works for 8bitpeoples, right? last I recall... .and Peter does TCTD. which happens to be a huge 8bitpeoples fan boi, nuff said... Null just happens to mange 8bitpeoples... it's all connected. I love the unity and sticking out for one another though... but there comes a point where it all just looks silly. I mean srsly.
Last edited by Mono (Jul 21, 2010 12:21 pm)