chipmusic.org is an online community in respect and relation to chip music, art and its parallels.
You are not logged in. Please login or register.
Yeah, bummer if there's no physical release, i dont mind if someone tries to makes some bucks with my work (even tho i know this kind of releases are mostly expenses for netlabel owners)
Also, it's not like i made a masterpiece worth millions so there's no need to whine so much, drop the guy's track and continue. Plink's work is greatly appreciated and i would pay my own shipping expenses just to keep it fair and no one losing money (i've been there)
tell you what i'll make it easy. Take me off the release and do what ever you want.
Re: Analog...
this comp was put together publicly, and apparently announced it would be done via a physical release publicly, so why can't the details of this be discussed publicly??
why the fuck am i being made out to be the bad guy here...
I simply dont want someone to be selling hardcopy releases with my material on it w/o some kind of contract being figured out.
That's not to say i want money. it's to say that while this is a physical release that people will have to pay for, it's a non-profit project, and that the person selling/releasing that comp will not make a profit off of the people who submitted a track to it.
You can't just say. "there might be a physical release" and expect anyone who submits is totally open to it being sold w/o further discussion.
If a physical release is being made to sell. Than EVERY contributor should be contacted via email and permission should be given by each person on the comp.
*flips on the capslock*
THERE HAS BEEN 0 COMMUNICATION ON THIS BEHIND CLOSED DOORS OR VIA PUBLIC FORUM
So excuse me if i pop on to find out that all of a sudden a track that i submitted for a comp months ago, is now all of a sudden going to press and will be made available for sale and i have yet to receive a single email asking me if this is ok.
I'll state this again. this isn't about me making money. this isn't about me making profit. But when money is involved with regards to a musical release, there had better be some communication about all the details of how the money is to be handled... be it for profit, or non-profit.
As stated, I'll just make things easier, since apparently i'm the only one who wanted to know wtf was going on w/ regards to a physical release...
Take me off this compilation and do what ever you want to do..
Last edited by low-gain (Aug 4, 2010 7:35 pm)
wow..guys...hold onnnn.....
let's get things straight.....because the last thing I want and need is to get misunderstood and have people think that i'm trying to make profit of others work!!!!First of all, I started error code 2 years ago, in order to "promote" the chiptune and circuit bent scene in Greece, where almost noone knew anything about it. It started with my own expenses, and I never tried to make even 1 euro from it. I've organized 6 events so far, and I've brought a couple of times people from abroad. I always try to make events with free entrance (or with a minimal fee if I have to pay the venue)....so far I have paid more than 500 euros from my own pocket, just to organize events, pay for domain/host, pay for other expenses like posters etc etc...and I never asked to make 1 euro.
Secondly, concerning releases, I've made 5 releases so far, 4 are of greek artists of which I also made limited (50-200 copies) physical cdr releases.
However, even though I paid most of the expenses on my own (in some cases artists also contributed in the expense), I never even tried to get my money back.....and still haven't started to sell cdrs online, we sell only in events and so far we got back around 30% of the initial investment for each cdr release. I believe that the above facts are solid proof that at least I, and consequently error code, are not in it for any kind of profit.Finally, concerning the detuned compilation.
I actually got involved after the tracks were ready and themistogles needed someone to release it.
However, I remember reading on the initial post, as already mentioned, that the guys who started the comp wanted to make a physical release also.
I don't know exactly what was said and done on the beginning, but I guess anyone who submitted tracks also read about the possible physical release.In any case to make things straight, I never intended to make a profit from the comp.
The mp3 version of the compilation will ofcourse be available for free download through error code server, for ever!
The physical release, which would be limited (number would be decided after the final cost estimation), would be sold for a minimal amount.
My first estimation on the price was around 7-8 euros shipped for everywhere in the world).Let's now analyze the cost of a DIY physical release.
Each compilation would require: 2 cdrs, printing materials, case materials, time + effort for creation, cdr duplicating devices, packaging materials and postage cost.
If you add everything up...you need for all the materials/printing cost around 2 euros + 1 euro for packaging materials + 3-5 euros for postage costs (depending on country)....
if you know some preliminary maths you would see that the cost might add up to 8 euros....without charging anything for all the time and effort I would have to offer to make everything possible.....
so, who can you see a profit here?The idea was to sent only 1 free copy to each contributor - - because there would be no profit....in fact i'm actually paying more than I would ever get from this compilation....
imagine that just for sending 1 free copy to 20 people ...means around 80-100 euros that I have to pay from my own pocket....just for postage costs to the people who contributed.....
And even if I sold the physical release for 9 euros...and make 1-2 euros profit...it would need more than 60-70 cdrs sold, just to get back the money I would spent to sent 1 free cd to all contributors....I really don't appreaciate people jumping around and accusing me without knowing what the situation is....especially when the discussion is about money....and when in reality i'm actually paying more than I would ever get, without ever asking anything in return.....!!!!
Low-gain, I'm sorry but there's no money for anyone here.....
I'm not doing this for the money, i'm doing this just because I like it ....!!!!
Noone ever mentioned a profit...before you did....
I don't like the whole issue here.....and I hate having to be apologetic without a proper reason....I'm sorry all this had to go out in public...but I got really frustrated when I read today's discussion and whining in the thread...and I wanted to clarify things for everyone interested.......
the worst thing for me in life is when you make effort for a common cause...without any self interest...and in the end....someone blames you for whatever issue...pffff....blew this....
To be honest, I'm not in the mood now to work anymore on this ....but I know cancelling the whole thing would be lame....
soooo.....since I have also other things going on in my life...and finding time to work for this release wasn't the easiest thing....i'm stopping all efforts for the physical release....I'll upload the compilation later on error code...and whoever wants can go download it for free.......
lowgain, if you want your track out of the online version of the comp...just let me know....
thanks for the breakdown.
i honestly have no problem with someone who has put in such a shit ton of effort to make a bit for all the time and energy put into it.
is this something that is being done to buy a new car? fuck no. honestly they'll be lucky to afford a box to piss in let alone a cup of coffee.
so i don't see profits as bad, in fact i would be surprised if someone undertook an effort like this and didn't hope to make a profit.
BUT!!!!
i don't see the profit as being monetary, no way, look at the effort and time involved in projects like this. now look at what the monetary profits are going to be. now figure what you're getting a hour. yah sucks for them eh?
so no way are people doing this for money, but instead a labor of love in which they intend to profit in less tangible way. exposure for a net label is one i for one had never heard of error code before this (not that i know squat about netlabels), more important is that warm glow you get reading the reply from someone who says "hoy fucking awesome! thanks guys"
anyway i personally consider this to be a nonstarter and not of consequence
I really don't appreaciate people jumping around and accusing me without knowing what the situation is....especially when the discussion is about money....and when in reality i'm actually paying more than I would ever get, without ever asking anything in return.....!!!!
Low-gain, I'm sorry but there's no money for anyone here.....
I'm not doing this for the money, i'm doing this just because I like it ....!!!!
Noone ever mentioned a profit...before you did....
I don't like the whole issue here.....and I hate having to be apologetic without a proper reason....I'm sorry all this had to go out in public...but I got really frustrated when I read today's discussion and whining in the thread...and I wanted to clarify things for everyone interested.......
the worst thing for me in life is when you make effort for a common cause...without any self interest...and in the end....someone blames you for whatever issue...pffff....blew this....
To be honest, I'm not in the mood now to work anymore on this ....but I know cancelling the whole thing would be lame....
soooo.....since I have also other things going on in my life...and finding time to work for this release wasn't the easiest thing....i'm stopping all efforts for the physical release....I'll upload the compilation later on error code...and whoever wants can go download it for free.......
lowgain, if you want your track out of the online version of the comp...just let me know....
No one accused you of anything man... But if you're such an experienced individual for doing releases for Non-Profit purposes..
then a simple email asking me (and the rest of the people on the comp) if it was OK that you sell a physical release w/ my track on it, explaining that it's a not-for-profit release would have been nice.
And dont pull that "i'm not in the mood now to work anymore on this" and make me out to be the bad guy.
Last edited by low-gain (Aug 4, 2010 9:03 pm)
No one accused you of anything man... But if you're such an experienced individual for doing releases for Non-Profit purposes..
then a simple email asking me (and the rest of the people on the comp) if it was OK that you sell a physical release w/ my track on it, explaining that it's a not-for-profit release would have been nice.And dont pull that "i'm not in the mood now to work anymore on this" and make me out to be the bad guy.
Actually man you did accuse me for a lot of things...
you publicly implied that me (and themistogles) wanted to take advantage of your work and make profit of it...
you directly said that I was lame, since I wanted to make a release without expecting to make a profit of it...
you were the one who spoke of profit publicly...
I will pull whatever I want to pull man...without asking for your permission...
you volunteered to submit a track for a comp, that from the start was aiming to make a physical release...it's not my fault if you are too lazy to read carefully what each guy says and then after months you come and claim that noone spoke to you about a physical release.....
To your surprise I have to inform you that - however cruel and ugly this world has become -- there are still people who are willing to make effort, pay expenses and put time into a project just because they like it!
I'm not an experienced individual who knows about non profit releases and such ... I'm just a lame guy who has fun making shitty music and noise for my own pleasure and a lame guy who wants to promote chiptune and circuit bent in Greece.....
If you had any problem - since you don't know me and my ways - it would be fair if you just addressed your concerns to me or to themistogles....not publicly...implying all sort of things....
I like doing things simply, and I like to believe that people have the best intentions all the time.....
I prefer to feel stupid and cheated....than to accuse or imply things for people that I don't even actually know.....
Anyway...I think we're making too much fuzz out of it....
I never thought we needed contracts and agreements just to make a simple physical release .....with no actual profit...
I'm sorry if my ways don't suit your ways man....next time maybe you should be more carefull ...and read more carefully each post (since the physical release possibilty was discussed from the start)....
And yeah...Of course you're track is out of the comp, I didn't need you to make it easy for me....
PS1: @ all the peopl - I want to thank everyone who replied to the thread for their support...and honest opinions...
PS2: @ lowgain - stop whining man about you seeming as the bad guy (you mentioned it at least twice in the last two posts) ...you didn't have the dignity to apologize...at least accept your shitty attitude and don't whine about it!!!
so no way are people doing this for money, but instead a labor of love in which they intend to profit in less tangible way. exposure for a net label is one i for one had never heard of error code before this (not that i know squat about netlabels), more important is that warm glow you get reading the reply from someone who says "hoy fucking awesome! thanks guys"
I couldnt describe it better man.....
that respect we might get for some people and the exposure that error code could get ...are the only true profits that I will ever have and would ever accept....
thanks!!!!
Apologize?
How about ... No.
And in the future when you take over a project, communicate with the artsts involved better.
Dont rely on a public forum that can be changed by the original poster at any given time to supply the artists with the updates/status of the comp.
because as you can see with the first post of this thread... it has changed.. and provides NO information about what the plan is for this comp.. etc.
lol...thanks for the advice man...i'll really take note of it 
next time i'll have a lawyer make some contracts....
and by the way....I don't see any artists complaining.....only you whining about profits that were never an issue since they're nonexistent....
anyway let's please quit it here...your track is out of the comp, so you don't have anything to lose...
Apologize?
How about ... No.
And in the future when you take over a project, communicate with the artsts involved better.
Dont rely on a public forum that can be changed by the original poster at any given time to supply the artists with the updates/status of the comp.because as you can see with the first post of this thread... it has changed.. and provides NO information about what the plan is for this comp.. etc.
to re-cap
comp will be released shortly
there will be a limited run of physical copies
this was communicated poorly causing some people to ask to have their work removed.
closing thread.