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Glasgow, Scotland.

Hey friends.

I am looking at getting one of the Catskull YM2149 synths, now that they have non-USB MIDI, and multiple outputs:

https://catskullelectronics.com/products/ym2149-synth

I noticed they come with either a YM2149 or AY-3 chip... and I'm not really sure what the difference is, or if it's worth getting both.

Would someone be able to enlighten me? Thank you!

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Bratislava, Slovakia

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_I … _AY-3-8910

Here you can find differences, i am more familiar with AY because it is in my Sinclair ZX Spectrum 128k, YM chip was in Atari. On PC i have AtariST player and Vortex tracker, where you can change between AY/YM modes.

Last edited by martin_demsky (Nov 16, 2020 8:29 pm)

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Glasgow, Scotland.
martin_demsky wrote:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_I … _AY-3-8910

Here you can find differences, i am more familiar with AY because it is in my Sinclair ZX Spectrum 128k, YM chip was in Atari. On PC i have AtariST player and Vortex tracker, where you can change between AY/YM modes.

Thanks. I'm trying to figure out if there are significant audible differences, worth getting both, or if there's much of a muchness. Do you have thoughts on that?

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Bratislava, Slovakia

Probably not, it is 99% same, in Vortex Tracker 2.5 when i change tune from AY to YM, there is not audible change. It is maybe matter of personal preference, if you love more Atari, then buy YM version smile

https://imgur.com/a/PezUP1E

Edit: here is good article between differences
https://maidavale.org/blog/ay-ym-differences/

Last edited by martin_demsky (Nov 16, 2020 9:25 pm)

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Glasgow, Scotland.

Thanks for the link! The sound comparison is useful. Looks like the YM would be the better option. The AY does sound a bit better on that particular comparison... but it seems like that's down more to mixing, as the YM seems panned harder? Not sure. Either way the difference seems minimal enough that I just need to make a call. Thank you!

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Bratislava, Slovakia

YM chip envelope have 5-bit volume, so it is not only 16 levels like in AY, but 32. Register accepts only 4-bit value, but maybe dynamics are that one bit better. Yamaha always make something better smile

I don't know if it is YM panned harder, on AY chip is output for every channel, i use ACB stereo out (a is left, c in both, b is right).

Last edited by martin_demsky (Nov 17, 2020 6:23 am)

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Glasgow, Scotland.

Thanks! I went for the the YM in the end smile

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Bratislava, Slovakia

Hey Bowtie, don't thank to me, i only googled smile BTW that device is interesting because it is small, if catskull develope something like this with SID chip, or with YM2612, i am in!

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NUMBSKULL

Sorry I missed this, but glad you got it figured out! I'm a bad person to ask but if you were to blindfold me, I would not be able to tell the difference between the AY or the YM. I'm sure purists out there that have spent a lot of time with the chips will tell me I'm wrong, which is fine!

Also trash80 designed and coded the whole thing, not me! Thanks to him! SID synths aren't as interesting to me, just because the chips are hard to come by. I guess now that there are implementations of it in FPGA and microcontrollers, maybe that would be worth checking out? For YM2612, I guess genMDM gets pretty far there, especially with Jamatar's genaJam that I'll be releasing soon.

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Glasgow, Scotland.
catskull wrote:

Sorry I missed this, but glad you got it figured out! I'm a bad person to ask but if you were to blindfold me, I would not be able to tell the difference between the AY or the YM. I'm sure purists out there that have spent a lot of time with the chips will tell me I'm wrong, which is fine!

Also trash80 designed and coded the whole thing, not me! Thanks to him! SID synths aren't as interesting to me, just because the chips are hard to come by. I guess now that there are implementations of it in FPGA and microcontrollers, maybe that would be worth checking out? For YM2612, I guess genMDM gets pretty far there, especially with Jamatar's genaJam that I'll be releasing soon.

I guess I could have just asked you directly hah. Thanks! I'll keep an eye out on the genaJam...

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Bratislava, Slovakia

It is little bit offtopic, but this Jamatar performance is outstanding! I am now doing some things on Kurzweil Forte in fm synthesis mode, i mapped every parameter to sliders and knobs, power of fm is incredible.

https://youtu.be/_nLA5kXui2M

Last edited by martin_demsky (Nov 20, 2020 7:23 pm)