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San Diego, CA
L-tron wrote:

I just get tired of all the praise people give some of these 2xLSDJ tracks for the sound design and how huge it is, especially when the artist doesn't mention that it is 2xLSDJ and just says "Made with LSDJ". It's like duh, this was made with 2 game boys, of course it's going to sound bigger. Again, there's nothing wrong in 2xLSDJ stuff in itself, it's just annoying when people view it and praise it as if it's made with 1.

Why does this annoy you? I don't really see any reason for it to bother you or anyone at all.

EDIT: the praise part, specifically

Last edited by spacetownsavior (Nov 3, 2012 7:23 pm)

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Los Angeles

i understand that tech specifics are appreciated here, but to most people saying the number of carts used wont mean jack. sometimes i use one cart, sometimes more. I'd rather just say one time that 'all' these songs were made with lsdj and nanoloop, instead of having to breakdown the details for every single track every time.

i like blanket statements, that cuz im lazy

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Robotcity, the year 20XX

I'm thinking of adding a second DMG to the reportoire: just so you have two wavs: one for sampling, the other for shredding synth basses. And some extra pulse channels don't hurt either. I understand where L-tron and an0va are coming from, but I am more with roboctopus on this one: I don't really see the difference between using a DMG + instrument or voice and using 2 x lsdj. And just consider: how boring would modern music be today if everyone tried to stay as minimal as possible in order to push creative boundaries?

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Santa Cruz Mountains, CA
4mat wrote:

This is why I stuck with the hybrid chipwaveforms/samples solution used by chip modules in Pro/Fast/Impulsetracker.   Tons of scope there, all within the same tool and a practically unlimited palette.

Agreed. That is what I love of those trackers.
And now I like to link lsdj or nl reach possibilities with mobile tools.

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São Paulo, Brazil

Thank God the only few gigs I get here in Brazil nowadays have its public formed by people who just want to have a good time and don't give a shit if I'm using one, two or three game boys or a computer with a DAW or whatever.

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The Multiverse ::: [CA, Sac]

Seems like some people in this thread would have a problem with my setup;
2x-3xLSDJ on AGSs, one is usually hooked to an arduinoboy controlling a keyboard (no audio from the gameboy) and an electribe mk II while a microkorg is being played over it live. All going through a mixer with a kp3 in the send and out through a mini kp.

I obviously never got into chip for the whole minimalist mentality, but I figure that's what sets me apart.

›  +

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Ulitmately I feel a lot more comfortable working with 1 LSDJ, it's easier to keep track of and just runs smoother overall. I think if I did too much work in 2 LSDJ I'd probably oversaturate my music, but I'll admit it really is nice to have the extra room sometimes. Me and Danimal's album is all 2 x LSDJ and it's working very well because one of us will right the basis for the song on one LSDJ then the other fills in their own half of the goodness on a second.

I've always enjoyed working with limitations though too; here's my old proof of concept 1 x WAV CHANNEL ONLY jam from over a year ago.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/33500021/LSDJ/Zef-Decimate.mp3
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/33500021/LSDJ/Z … ate.lsdsng

Last edited by Zef (Nov 5, 2012 4:09 pm)

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fixed

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Scotland
spacetownsavior wrote:
L-tron wrote:

I just get tired of all the praise people give some of these 2xLSDJ tracks for the sound design and how huge it is, especially when the artist doesn't mention that it is 2xLSDJ and just says "Made with LSDJ". It's like duh, this was made with 2 game boys, of course it's going to sound bigger. Again, there's nothing wrong in 2xLSDJ stuff in itself, it's just annoying when people view it and praise it as if it's made with 1.

Why does this annoy you? I don't really see any reason for it to bother you or anyone at all.

EDIT: the praise part, specifically

I entirely empathise with L-Tron's thought. It's misleading in that, there's a certain implication by saying 'LSDJ' that it is one copy. If the person feels the need to omit the 'x2', it may also follow that there's deceptive intent. That, whether we like it or not, people are going to just blend x1 and x2 in their head. And not appreciate the difficulty of writing with x1.

It's like the One Channel and Two Channels compilations. Most tracks didn't interest me much as songs, but more for technical studies. It wasn't going on my iPod, but I would listen to it. LSDJx2 feels te same. It's a great for technical study, but the songs don't hold true to something, and that something that works in my head as follows.

The joy about writing with one copy of LSDJ for me is that I grew up with the GameBoy. It was my only form of portable music until I was 13, when I bought myself a portable tape player. You attach your ears to that aesthetic, and it's one of my influences. I make video-game style chip music. Many wish to push their music into other aesthetics, but it's the video-game style that interests me. I simply can't get my head around people who didn't grow up with the sounds and playing the games, wanting to take to it. I'm faced with the same limitations as the composers who wrote the music I grew up with. I feel like a composer. I don't feel like a musician. Now, I make music that's guitar, uke, synths, drum machines, and vocals all meshed up with LSDJ, and they make me feel like a musician. But they're very separate kinds of songs. Like Radiohead having an acoustic track on an album. At that point, purity goes out of the window.

Many scoff at 'composer', "pft, haha, you're not a 'composer' you're fucking about with a GameBoy" and yeah, maybe so. But you're still working within the confines that digital composers, many moons ago, were working with. You are on equal par. And after the first time you write something that sounds polished enough that it could actually be in a video-game, it's beautiful. It's like homebrew games, how you'd want to make a video-game, and you did in your head - but if you were able to make a comprehensive game on the GameBoy itself, can you imagine how popular that would be? (Neil Baldwin, I thank you in advance.) Seeing your characters move on screen for the first time, but then there being a bug where you can't pick up items, the same sort of problem solving, frustration and relief felt with writing music on the console. And I think everyone has that want to make a video-game. If you could pay £40 or $60 or whatever to have your thoughts translated into a playable video-game, you definitely would.

But it's that want to push the system in a way that your predecessors couldn't, and didn't have time to. The next point is when you write music that's better than some of the really good music on the console. That's just great, then. It's validating.

But when I'm adding other instruments, I'm not making the music because of the limitations of the hardware and software, I'm making the music for the audial aesthetic. I'm making an art instead of a chiptune. I'm being a 'musician', not a 'composer'.

So, in for a penny in for a pound, why use just x2 LSDJ? No-one else did. I feel the solo guitar instrument isn't valid. I'd compare it more to a full band, then adding another full band over the top. If you have six guitarists on stage, you either must be a member of Minus the Bear, or have a bloody good reason. Then you tell four of the guitarists that they can only use a very basic effects pedal, with very simple tone. And tell the two bassists that sometimes they may be a drummer and may need to occasionally shout "BRK",  "ASS" and "TITTIES". You really have to ask yourself what it's bringing to the table.

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Harrisonburg, Virginia
Edward Shallow wrote:

So, in for a penny in for a pound, why use just x2 LSDJ? No-one else did. I feel the solo guitar instrument isn't valid. I'd compare it more to a full band, then adding another full band over the top. If you have six guitarists on stage, you either must be a member of Minus the Bear, or have a bloody good reason. Then you tell four of the guitarists that they can only use a very basic effects pedal, with very simple tone. And tell the two bassists that sometimes they may be a drummer and may need to occasionally shout "BRK",  "ASS" and "TITTIES". You really have to ask yourself what it's bringing to the table.

Isn't that what you're already doing with 1xLSDJ? You're telling two guitarists that they can only use basic effects pedal(s), your bassist that (etc., etc.). I get where you're coming from, but that metaphor doesn't really hold water.

I view 2xLSDJ in the same way I viewed linking together GBs to trade Pokemon: you get more out of the "game" than if you had only one. Granted, you could also cheat with it, but it definitely allows you more leeway with the instrument. Similar to guitar pedals augmenting a guitar's sound, 2xLSDJ can help you augment your sound. And that works whether you consider yourself a musician or a composer.

Many modern composers use synths, live rock bands, guitars, etc., etc. That's really a perspective thing so I can't argue it, but I still view 2x/3xLSDJ as an augmentation not a degredation of 1xLSDJ.

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Czech republic

This is insane.

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Scotland

You may have missed my points. I gave the analogy so you'd understand what I meant by composer. An 8bit composer. Someone who composes for video-games. The 8bit aesthetic is what we get out of one piece of kit. Absolutely not a single game for NES or GameBoy featured a track written to be played back on multiple machines.

Your analogy for Pokémon is good, in that it demonstrates how absolutely useless it is. Pokémon exists purely for the use of the link cable. That's why Shigsy went for it. And it's almost entirely useless. You get a few tag on Pokémon. It was the illusion of interactivity. It was a gimmick. It was a fun gimmick. But it also forced those with just one copy feel excluded, because they couldn't even complete the game they bought.

I didn't say it's a degradation. It just isn't comparable. I'm saying it's the authenticity of a video-game aesthetic. You cannot achieve that with 2xLSDJ. "Look at my black and white painting, yes, it does have yellow and green paint, as well, but I still view it as an augmentation not a degradation of painting." And I'm not saying it's a bad black and white painting. I'm just saying it isn't a black and white painting. So, it can't be a bad one of them. It isn't bringing shame to the name of anything. So, what I think L-Tron is saying is, many find it difficult to differentiate between certain sounds (in a way that doesn't happen with sight, as much). So, if you list your paintings as black and white, but you mean "black and white, and yellow and blue" it could just be misleading to someone who can't differentiate such things. It makes us traditionalist purist pricks feel hard done by, because it's the black and white painters who use colour that are given the attention for 'fullness'.

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Madison, Alabama
Russellian wrote:

I view 2xLSDJ in the same way I viewed linking together GBs to trade Pokemon: you get more out of the "game" than if you had only one.

Hahaha, me too.  Every time I hook the link cable up I think about the fact that I'm about to make music using the same thing I used to trade pokemon with in the 90s. 

Edward Shallow wrote:

So, in for a penny in for a pound, why use just x2 LSDJ? No-one else did.

See, this reasoning doesn't make much sense to me.  So you're saying that you might as well use real instruments/synths/whatever if you're going to bother using 2xLSDJ?  For starters, one more Game Boy in my gig bag takes up way less space than real instruments--portability is a factor for some of us.  There are lots of little reasons someone might choose to use 2xLSDJ over another instrument.

A person may make the decision to compose with two Game Boys for the exact reasons you might choose to compose with one: nostalgia, forced limitations, portability, and cheap equipment.

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NC in the US of America

This thread is giving me a headache... =S

If it sounds full, then it sounds full. If people like how it sounds, then they like how it sounds. But I guess that's the weird thing about chipmusic. So much of it is focused on "look at what I can DOO with all these limitations. I'm just awesome like that.". As more artists come up who aren't associated with that "keygen intro" mentality, they just want to make music that sounds cool and familiar to what they grew up with, but to make it their OWN music.

They don't seem to be so worried about receiving praise for crossing the Atlantic on a toothpick.

It just seems like, as people are not used to hearing the sounds of a Gameboy used in such a lush way, they just get overwhelmed and have to praise it, despite the fact that it's two Gameboys. It's a knee-jerk reaction, provided you are not biased against 2xLSDJ to begin with.

The only thing you can do is try to beat them, or join them, or just go on with your art and nuts to the rest.

And tell the two bassists that sometimes they may be a drummer

Slap and pop.

If you have six guitarists on stage

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kEleJOiBFLM
I cheated it's 4 guitars and an orchestra.

Last edited by SketchMan3 (Nov 5, 2012 9:02 pm)

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Isn't relativism grand?

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Canada

I maintain that if you like it then you should use it...
or put a ring on it.