289 Reply by roboctopus

(55 replies, posted in General Discussion)

Faerlight, people might post irritated replies because in this community, this is an old debate that comes up often.

That being said, I think it is a medium, but a medium with such severe stylistic ticks and limitations that it confuses people.  If you can pick up a game boy and make a funk tune, a dance track, a bossa nova piece, and something with a European folk dance flavor, then that's a medium.

What confuses people is that due to hardware limitations, composer often resort to stylistic tricks like arps or bass and drum on the same channel.  These things, coupled with the distinct sound of raw waveforms and noise percussion, lead people to apply the genre tag.

My theory, anyway.

My game boy music is not in the same genre as Danimal Cannon or Monodeer, etc.  Medium, I say!

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290 Reply by roboctopus

(617 replies, posted in Releases)

kvee wrote:

I'll be releasing a new EP (called N/EP) made on the NES on 11/28!

I really like that cover!

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291 Reply by roboctopus

(21 replies, posted in Nintendo Handhelds)

BR1GHT PR1MATE wrote:

yeah, or R commands, or switching between waveforms in the PW channels, or H commands or tempo related things with G commands haha. it's a long list of things to avoid XD

for my own music I don't mind the pops at all, just part of the aesthetic. but I feel weird turning in noisy recordings to clients.

Really?  have you tried different DMGs?  I've never noticed pops related H or G commands, and barely any glaring pops related to duty cycle changes on the pulse channel, and I usually track with things at pretty low volumes.  I have DMGs that deffinitely make more noises than other DMGs.

Some people may call this heresy, but have you tried exporting the sound from BGB?  If you're going to great lengths in post to get a clean sound, you may as well try BGB.  The difference in sound will probably be negligible (re: your clients will likely not realize you used an emulator), and while BGB's sound is pretty darn accurate, it is less poppy-clicky and you'll have a cleaner product.


BR1GHT PR1MATE wrote:
Auxcide wrote:

In answer to your op question regarding SPs i've noticed little to no clicks or pops as a result of E commands. Especially compared to my DMGs. But one of my SPs does make a little noise, so you have to find the right kind. This is hard because it's not a difference in their serial. They're both AGS-100s but my red one just makes little pops even when you press buttons. My light gray one doesn't.

that's really good to know. I have some sp shopping in my future then... to ebay!

My SP is SUPER noisy.  It might be my cheap third-party headphone adapter, but beware.  The hiss is strong with it.

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292 Reply by roboctopus

(21 replies, posted in Nintendo Handhelds)

On pulse channels, I avoid using many E commands with sudden changes (say, 18 to 38), as they seem to cause a lot of pops.  K commands will too, not as noticeable but if you have K commands on both pulse chans simultaneously.  Other than E commands and stacked Ks, O commands are the obvious enemy.

For the WAV, if you want the synth to step through the frames and there are big changes in sound from one frame to the next, there's just not much of a way around that clicking sound.  A work around might be to use F commands so that the clicks are in tempo and less noticeable.

Other than careful programming to minimize the noises, I don't know that there's much you can do beyond editing them in post.

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293 Reply by roboctopus

(12 replies, posted in Releases)

Yeah, there's some rad stuff on here.  Great work Bitman!

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294 Reply by roboctopus

(134 replies, posted in Nintendo Handhelds)

Victory Road wrote:

you could sidechain and m/s in any number of free software solutions, though!

Yeah, but I don't even have a laptop I could use live, haha.

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295 Reply by roboctopus

(134 replies, posted in Nintendo Handhelds)

dubmood wrote:

When I played dancemusic with a gameboy I sometimes routed the kick Left and everything else Right and then compressed and EQued the kick, splitted the L signal and used it as a sidechain source to the Right track using an Avalon 747. Worked well, could make a fat square chan kick, use sidechain compression on the Right track and didnt need a second LSDJ. And if you like to pan leads and other stuff when making harmonies n shit, then just split the R signal again and go for a mixer or rack-EQ that can do proper M/S.

Just a tip!

I would add that a second LSDJ is much, much cheaper than an Avalon 747.

Or pretty much any outboard compressor, really. 

Don't get me wrong, I respect you and I think your music is amazing, but your suggestion completely misses the point a lot of us use a second DMG for.  I might not be able to afford a compressor or a rack-EQ, but I *can* afford a second game boy.

Just sayin'.

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296 Reply by roboctopus

(134 replies, posted in Nintendo Handhelds)

I think I agree with ant1.  Time to go watch some election coverage!

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297 Reply by roboctopus

(134 replies, posted in Nintendo Handhelds)

danimal cannon wrote:

Can we shit all over Moe Moe Kyunstep for using a VRC6 expansion now?

I almost compared 2xlsdj to NES and vrc6, but didn't, for fear of the fallout, but yeah, those expansion chips are cheating.

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298 Reply by roboctopus

(134 replies, posted in Nintendo Handhelds)

10k wrote:

I am so confused by this thread. It's like asking if bands should have one guitarist or two. Horses for courses.

Man, me too, and I'm participating in it!  When I clicked on this thread I thought it might be a technical discussion about technique or something, but instead it's people worried about "purity" (who are somehow still okay if you play the guitar, just as long as you're only doing it with one game boy?  Or something like that?) and people worried about 2xLSDJ songs being passed off as 1XLSDJ songs.


4mat wrote:

What I don't get is, why don't more people code their own drivers?  if they're looking for new ideas with the same hardware why not write your own players?   Put some of yourself into the tools you're using, that's something hardly anyone gets to do with real instruments.  All the info is out there and a music driver is probably one of the easier coding tasks to undertake.   (an editor is another matter)

Anyway, enough thread derailing.

I assume you mean audio drivers for the DMG?  How hard would this be for someone who has absolutely no knowledge of coding?  And what might be accomplished with new audio drivers? 

(Forgive me if this is an ignorant question, I was a liberal arts major with a focus on literature and writing.  I make my living writing and editing, and do not know much about software/coding/etc.  But I'd be willing to learn.)

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299 Reply by roboctopus

(134 replies, posted in Nintendo Handhelds)

Edward Shallow wrote:
roboctopus wrote:

Well, the point that I was suggesting is that if you want to create music with a bigger sound, yet want the portability and economy of a Game Boy, then choosing to use two DMGs as opposed to something larger and more costly would be a fairly logical choice.

 
You're still entirely missing my point. Right, the drum machine is just an example. I could have said spoon. Or a stylophone. It's just an example of something that isn't the restrictions of 1xLSDJ. It's something that isn't keeping with original GameBoy and NES music.

No, I didn't miss your point.  You were just so completely dismissive of using a 2nd Game Boy (calling it "useless" based on the idea that Pokemon was invented just to use the link cable...or something like that).  I was merely trying to politely explain why someone might decide to enhance their sound by adding a second Game Boy as opposed to something else, citing economy, portability, and providing the same nostalgic sound-set.

I mean, we're having a discussion on the merits of using two DMGs, which is an esoteric topic for super chip-nerds, to be sure. tongue

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300 Reply by roboctopus

(134 replies, posted in Nintendo Handhelds)

Edward Shallow wrote:
roboctopus wrote:

See, this reasoning doesn't make much sense to me.  So you're saying that you might as well use real instruments/synths/whatever if you're going to bother using 2xLSDJ?

Yes, precisely. Because the line has been crossed for standard restrictions. Like two beat boxers. It's fantastic to watch, but I find it much more interesting to listen to one, because I can listen out for how to tones make up a sound. I can try to replicate the sound of a beat boxer using my own vocals. As I said, it's entirely based on what I view my reasoning for making the music, but I'm sure it rings true for many.

Well, the point that I was suggesting is that if you want to create music with a bigger sound, yet want the portability and economy of a Game Boy, then choosing to use two DMGs as opposed to something larger and more costly would be a fairly logical choice.
 

danimal cannon wrote:

-For every loss of limitation, there's a whole new challenge that arises.  It's not what I would call an EASY process.  Often times when I want to use the 2nd gameboy to write a solo, I need to make a scratch bassline and click track on the 2nd gameboy so I can hear the chord changes in context better.  This is after I've switched the 2nd gameboy from slave to off.  Then I'll delete the scratch tracks, reset the slave option and actually listen to it in context.  Chances are I'll have to repeat this several times to get it exactly how I want it.
...
And what's the point?  The point is, it doesn't matter.  It isn't just all roses with 4 pulse channels.  2xLSDJ is DIFFICULT to compose with.  I can't use emulators like I love to, I need to bust out a mixer any time I want to write anything... the list goes on.  They all have pluses and minuses.

That is why I try to have the track's frame finished on 1 before fleshing it out with the second.  Basslines and leads all finished, and overall structure done. Copy/paste below and dump onto cart #2 to flesh out harmonies or extra echoes or chords or whatever.  Doing it that way really cut down on scratch tracks, and I can start my tracks on an emulator and keep them emulator-bound for longer.

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301 Reply by roboctopus

(134 replies, posted in Nintendo Handhelds)

Russellian wrote:

I view 2xLSDJ in the same way I viewed linking together GBs to trade Pokemon: you get more out of the "game" than if you had only one.

Hahaha, me too.  Every time I hook the link cable up I think about the fact that I'm about to make music using the same thing I used to trade pokemon with in the 90s. 

Edward Shallow wrote:

So, in for a penny in for a pound, why use just x2 LSDJ? No-one else did.

See, this reasoning doesn't make much sense to me.  So you're saying that you might as well use real instruments/synths/whatever if you're going to bother using 2xLSDJ?  For starters, one more Game Boy in my gig bag takes up way less space than real instruments--portability is a factor for some of us.  There are lots of little reasons someone might choose to use 2xLSDJ over another instrument.

A person may make the decision to compose with two Game Boys for the exact reasons you might choose to compose with one: nostalgia, forced limitations, portability, and cheap equipment.

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302 Reply by roboctopus

(27 replies, posted in Nintendo Handhelds)

SuperBustySamuraiMonkey wrote:

¿Could someone explain a lil bit on the aliens commands? Im experimenting a bit with em on the wave channel but I get no clue wtf Im doing.

Here's a tutorial I wrote on F commands:  http://www.noisechannel.org/4824

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303 Reply by roboctopus

(134 replies, posted in Nintendo Handhelds)

L-tron wrote:

Why do I care so much? Cause I guess at heart I'm a purist prick and am drawn to the aesthetic appeal of music made with one copy of LSDJ and people "pushing limits" with that. Also I love when I'm listening to a track and I'm thinking "wait, is this only one game boy or is it two?" and it ends up being only one.

...

Also LSDJ + something else is cool too.

Don't get me wrong I *love* it when I hear a mind blowing track and find out it's just one Game Boy. 

But saying you love the purity of 1xLSDJ, feel that 2 is somehow "less pure", but that you like LSDJ + something else is like me saying "I love solo classical guitar, but I don't like pieces with two classical guitars, but I do like classical guitar with piano, or percussion, or cello, etc."

So what I'm struggling to understand is why the second Game Boy is stigmatized whereas a guitar or Ableton is not.


Edit, just saw this:

Victory Road wrote:

victory lapse and roots were both completely 1x albums afaik, so anything's possible.

Yeah, Victory Lapse was 1x, recorded straight, no channel separating, cause multitracking DMGs irritates me. I can never get the tracks to perfectly sync.

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304 Reply by roboctopus

(134 replies, posted in Nintendo Handhelds)

an0va wrote:

I love both, but I tend to gravitate towards straight LSDJ releases. I assure you it's not some kind of philosophical thing on "what chiptune is" at all-it's a purely an aesthetic choice and not a workflow one! I think it's because I'm really specifically interested in that exact medium. I've also personally been messing with Renoise and I listen to releases with all kinds of instrumentation very often but 2xLSDJ hasn't really caught my eye yet in that sense. I guess I haven't heard a 2xLSDJ song yet that made me say to myself, "holy crap I really gotta try syncing gameboys." The closest thing I ever would get to that is where I wrote a song on 1xLSDJ and still demanded something more to fill the arrangement which hasn't happened to me (yet). Even then I might just use the same gameboy and multitrack the needed part live, but I haven't come to a point where I wanted to have a whole nother dedicated empty channel for it. Maybe sometime in the future.

I dig.  I guess my point is that I almost view 1xLSDJ and 2xLSDJ as different mediums.  I would treat the second game boy the same way I would treat guitar overdubs or adding tambourine or something.  A different approach for a different sound kind of thing, which is totally an aesthetic and personal choice.

Another reason I do it sometimes is because I *hate* multitracking game boys, haha.  If I can't get all my game boy parts recorded in one take I might as well be adding guitar or synth.  Er, which I do sometimes anyway.

Anyhow, carry on!


Also, this:

SketchMan3 wrote:

I try not to let "technical prowess" get in the way of my enjoyment of music. As long as it sounds cool, that's impressive enough for me.

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